噪声 Noise
我 I
我真的很喜欢这里 I really like it down here.
我就住在世贸中心附近 I live literally right by the world trade center
我走路回家 I walk home
我的脚踝手镯 my ankle bracelet
告诉政府我在哪 tell the government where I am
每天的每一秒 every second of the day,
一天中的任何时候 anytime of the day.
但它会掉下来的 But it's gonna come off
当我进监狱的时候 when I go to prison
我想 I think
我觉得我没有在监狱里学到什么 And I don't think I'm learning some prison
这就是我们的计划 that's what that's what the plan is for that.
休斯敦大学 Uh
今日市场收盘价 closing numbers on the markets today
一度 At one point
这是一个历史性的日子 华尔街的根基被动摇了 it was a historic day with wall street shaken to its very foundation
被质疑 being called into question
我们有前财政部长 他们从政府到华尔街兜售数亿美元 We have former secretaries of treasury who go from government to wall street pocketing hundreds of millions of dollars
是 啊 Yeah.
2008年 我有点痴迷于 In 2008, I came somewhat obsessed with
角色 the role
货币本身在危机中扮演的角色以及政府和银行在货币中扮演的角色 that money itself played in the crisis and the role that governments and banks played in money
为什么我们的钱被中央银行控制了 And why was it that our money was controlled by central banks
如果有新的情况发生 政府会给它一个 If something new happens, is the government likely to give it a
点头 nod
或者至少忽略一段时间 or at least ignore it for a while
或者政府可能会来镇压它 Or is the government likely to come down and try to crush it
因为他们害怕任何新的和不同的东西 Because they're afraid of anything new and different
这是一笔钱 This is a monetary
革命 revolution.
比特币是真正的货币 Bit coin is the honest currency
噪音 noise
是 啊 yeah
噪音 noise
嗯 um.
好吧 这周我们一直在讨论钱 Okay, this past week we've been talking about money.
我要问大家你认为钱是什么能给我一些答案 I'm gonna ask everybody what you think money is can give me some answers
钱就像纸一样 money is like paper,
你可以用它买东西 and you can like buy stuff with it
所以你必须有四个四角五分的成人票 So you have to have like four quarters for adult
水 water,
氧气 oxygen oxygen
钱基本上只是一个会计系统 money is basically just an accounting system
这是一种记录谁拥有的方法 It is a way of recording who owns
谁拥有什么 what who has what
谁欠谁什么 who owes what to whom
钱就是这么多 That is all money really is
一个值得信赖的第三方 somebody who was the trusted 3rd party
保证钱是真的 someone who guarantee that the money was real
几百年来我们一直有政府发行的货币 And For hundreds of years now we've had government issue money
阿盖恩 Again
金钱只是一种会计制度 money is just an accounting system
这就是大硬币 That's what big coin is
比特币其实只是一种会计制度 Bit coin is really just an accounting system
这是一种记录交易记录价值的方法 It is a way of recording transactions recording value
它以数字方式运行 And it does it digitally
所以我们可以直接把它发给对方 So you and I can send it to each other directly
通过监控和更新账本 by monitoring and updating that ledger
你不需要中间人来储存所有的信息 uh you do away with the need for somebody in the middle having to be the sort of repository of all the Information
这就是从收费中得到的好处 And That's what gets away from the fees
效率低下 the inefficiencies
最终 以这种方式集中信息会带来腐败和风险 and ultimately the potential for corruption and risk that come with centralizing Information in that way
不 No,
它所做的是利用可信的第三方功能并使其自动化 what it does is it takes that that trusted 3rd party function and it automates it it
把它放进一个公开的分类账 放在网上 任何人都可以看到 puts it into an open ledger that is put online that is there for anybody to see
所以每一个比特币都被计算在内这样你就知道你不会得到一个伪造的比特币 so that every bit coin is accounted for so that you know that you're not getting a counterfeit bit coin
值得注意的是 比特币的概念是在雷曼兄弟破产 整个系统几乎崩溃几周后才提出的 It's kind of remarkable that this idea of bit coin was launched just a few weeks after lehman brothers went bankrupt and the whole system nearly collapsed
危机中出现的问题在很大程度上是中村佐史著作的一部分 And the problems that cropped up in the crisis were very much a part of the writings of satoshi nakamoto
现有的制度有一些重大缺陷 the existing system had some major flaws
没用的 It wasn't working
人们渴望某种替代品 and people were hungry for some sort of alternative
是 啊 Yeah,
是 啊 yeah.
但当我第一次意识到它不是由一个中央公司或中央人控制时 我发现了奎因的力量 I discovered but quins power when I understood for the first time that it was not controlled by a central company or central person
因为我知道这意味着它不能被关闭 because I knew that meant it couldn't be shut down
只需要做点有用的事 all it needs is to do something useful
它将越来越被采纳 And it will become more and more adopted
随着价值的增长 人们发现了越来越多的用途 And as the value grows, people find more and more uses for it.
美丽 The beauty
一个比特币 容易转移吗 匿名的 a bit coin, is it's easily transferable, it's anonymous
到2014年 And by 2014
那就有2100万了 that's gonna be 21 million
那是帽子 And that's the cap
只有x个金币 只有x个大点 There's only x amount of gold. There's only x amount of big point
之前 before
如果你想通过互联网发送有价值的东西 你就得让别人参与进来 If you wanted to send something of value across the internet, you had to get somebody else involved
你必须有信用卡公司或是贝宝 You had to have a credit card company or paypal
或者是银行 or maybe a bank
参与交易 比特币的承诺是 involved in the transaction. The promise of bit coin is that
直接把这种货币寄给另一个人 directly sending this currency to another person
执行贝宝或银行或信用卡公司通常会执行的功能 performs the function that normally paypal or bank or your credit card company would perform
比特币真的把控制权放回去了 Bit coin really puts the control back
所有参与的人都掌握在手中 in the hands of everybody everybody who's participating
比特币系统控制着它的运作方式 The bit coin system is controlling how it works
很好 这意味着测试 That's good. And that meant that the test,
如果你想寻找加密货币的起源 and if you want to look for the genesis of crypto currency
这是一个你知道的暗语前线运动 是出于对互联网的热爱和它的可能性 uh it was a cypher front movement you know growing out of a kind of a love of the internet and its possibilities
密码学的发现和想象你能在互联网上创造一个新世界 the Discovery of cryptography and imagining that you could actually uh give birth to a new world really uh out of the internet,
一个生活在民族国家之外的世界 一个与之相关的权力结构和等级制度之外的世界 that um that a world that lives outside of the nation state and outside the structures of power and the hierarchies that are associated with that
这些人讨论了使用匿名或使用加密技术匿名的数字货币的必要性和可能性 These people had talked about the need and the possibility for a digital currency that was anonymous or could be anonymous using cryptography
九十年代初出现的塞弗朋克极度关注隐私 The cypher punks that emerged in the early nineties were hyper concerned about privacy
关于人身自由 about personal liberty
很多人都有自己的系统 And a lot of people come up with their own systems
其中一些很快就要发生了 Some of them came very close to happening
骄傲来了的那个 The one the pride came
最接近的是大卫·查默的数字现金 the closest was digit cash from david charm
支付隐私权实际上是民主的必要条件 Privacy of payments is actually essential for democracy
为了表达你自己的想法 私人支付 private payments in order to express yourself
而是为了告诉你自己 but rather that in order to inform yourself
你可能需要购买信息 you may need to purchase Information
这就是你可以拥有的东西 And that's the thing that allows you to have
值得表达 are worth expressing
虽然我不认为大卫·汤姆是个网络流氓 Although I wouldn't say david tom was a cyber punk
他肯定激发了密码朋克的运动 he definitely inspired the cipher punk movements
大卫喜欢一些外星物种的技术 david charms tools like the technology of some alien species
他们只拿走了他们最感兴趣的武器以及那些可以用来剥夺政府权力和个人权力的武器 and they only took the weapons they were most interested and the ones that could be used to dis empower the government and power individuals
当他意识到他需要现有的机构来帮助他时 他和塞弗的小混混们就分手了 The break between him and the cypher punks came when he realized he would need existing institutions to help him with it
所以他开始和政府对话 So he started talking to governments
他开始和班克斯谈话 He started talking to banks
他在九十年代末就要发生这种事了 没人准备好了 He was very close to having this thing happen in the late nineties and nobody was really prepared for this
人们似乎几乎放弃了这个项目 除了一些实验 在这里和那里 是多么费劲 啊 不鞠躬 people seemed like had almost sort of given up on the project other than a few experiments here and there by how finny uh nix a bow
金融危机之后 它突然复活了 and then all of a sudden it came back to life after the financial crisis
你让人们回到20世纪90年代的那些实验中去寻找将这些想法整合起来的新方法 And you had people going back to those experiments in the 1990s and looking at new ways of putting those ideas together
2006年他刚在法学院度过中年 Uh Nix a bow in 2006 had just finished up a midlife stint at law school
合同隐私权与政府和其他可信第三方的问题 privacy on contracts and the problems of governments and other trusted 3rd parties
他又把大金带回了谈话中 And he brought big gold back into the conversation
芬尼是怎么想到自己的妹妹的 And So how finney come up with his own sister
后面的夫人有零花钱 madame back has hash cash
她在2008年做了什么 So what's that oh she did in 2008
桑托 Santo
创建了一个基于加密的协议 and created an encryption based protocols
允许多种交易发生合同 allowing for many kinds of transactions to occur contracts
各种各样的东西都可以嵌入到区块链中 all kinds of things can be built into the block chain
它通过一个建立共识的系统来实现这一点在这个系统中 多台计算机都参与了区块链账本的管理 And It does this through a system of consensus building where multiple computers all participate in the the management of the block chain ledger
那种数字文件 the kind of digital document
如果你愿意的话 if you will
记录所有的付款 that keeps track of all the payments
是 啊 Yeah,
是 啊 yeah
你知道的 know that.
我知道是这样的 I understand it's something that
是即时在线的吗 is instantaneous uh online
你知道他们有钱 you know they have their money
货币 currency
我想她今早肯定参加过战斗或是什么技术性的 And I'm thinking she must have been in the battle this morning or something technical
你知道吗 Say you know what what
你知道 但他们说这是给没有银行账户的人的 you know but they say it's for people who don't have bank accounts
我不能理解 I can't understand
如果你有一枚硬币 If you have one coin
假设它值一百五十美元 it's let's say it's worth hundred and $50
你是做什么的 Um What do you do
把电话号码或者别的什么给说话人 Give the number or something to the say
然后减去它 and then they subtract it
你怎么知道你是怎么改变的 How How Do You Know How do you make change
你怎么知道你还剩下什么 花了什么 How do you know what you have left or what you've spent
你可以用电脑控制货币供应量 You can have the money supply controlled by a computer
那都是废话 That's all bit
硬币的关键在于这是一个分布式账本 Coin really is the key point here is that this is a distributed ledger
没有中央调查 There is no central survey
我们所有的账本 All the other ledgers that we have
所有银行账簿 all banking ledgers
所有公司账簿 all company ledgers
他们都坐在公司里 they all sit and reside inside that company
也就是说他们只有一个攻击点 which means they have one point of attack
他们可以被黑 they can be hacked
摩根大通被网络窃贼入侵了 Jp morgan was was hacked by you know cyber thief
不久前 Not so long ago
家得宝目标 Home depot target
有一个中央信息库 there's one central repository of Information.
你知道成千上万台电脑上都有一个大的硬币分类账 The big coin ledger resides on you know thousands of computers
你不能这么做 You can't hack that
每一笔交易都有记录 Every single transaction is recorded
一旦它被记录在区块链中 and once it is recorded in the block chain
就在那里 是永久的 it is there it is permanent
它不能改变 It cannot be altered
它不能改变 所以你可以读它 It cannot be changed so that you can read it
现在 Now
人们的身份被加密 钱包被加密 the identities of the people are encrypted, the wallets are encrypted
所以你不知道谁在花钱 So you don't know who is spending the money
但你知道每一枚硬币都有一段历史你知道它在哪里你知道不同的地址 But you know that every single bit coin out there has a history you know where it's been you know the different addresses
最重要的部分 the most important pieces of the bit
硬币基础设施是矿工 Coin infrastructure are the miners
维护区块链的分类账以验证信息的任务 that a task with maintaining the ledger of the block chain to verify the Information
更新它 to update it
确保这是可信的 to make sure that this is trustworthy
那我们该怎么激励眼睛呢 所以呢 So how do we incentive eyes them to do? So?
他们正在确认交易的过程中 As they are going through the process of confirming transactions
受到 being subjected to a very
非常困难的计算测试 very difficult computing test
比特币核心协议强迫他们寻找一个数字 The bit coin core protocol is is forcing them to look for a number
所有这些矿工最终都在竞争成为每10分钟收到一次奖金的矿工 All of these miners are ultimately competing to be the one that receives that payout every 10 minutes
但实际上这是第二个组成部分 But really that's the secondary component
他们真的因为更重要的任务得到了比特币的奖励 They're really being rewarded with bit coin for what is the more important task
比特币成为第一个实现分散价值交换的圣杯 bit coin in being the first to achieve this holy grail of decentralized value exchange
把信任的过程转移到围绕一个独立计算机的集体协议上 that transfers that process of trust to a collective agreement around a a body of independent computers
他们被一个激励系统强迫去保持共识并确定信息是正确的 who are compelled by an incentive system to maintain that consensus and firm the Information to be correct
令人难以置信的自由 is incredibly liberating
因为这意味着我们可以不用这些中间人 because it means that we can do it without all these intermediaries
在这些不同的领域里 In all these different realms
比特币背后最重要的不是货币 The most important thing behind bit coin is not the currency
关键因素是区块链 The key factor is the block chain
没人料到会这样 Nobody expected this
你知道在2008年 You Know In 2008
你知道很少有人关心它 you know very few people cared about it
真正感兴趣的代码极客 code geeks that were really interested in
在我所有的交流中 in all my communications that oh she was ever
不管是比特币论坛 还是那些 um by either the bit coin talk forums which all of that
沟通是 communication is
公共或私人四条信息或私人电子邮件 public or private four messages or private emails.
所以她一直都是公事公办的 So she was always all business
一直都是关于密码的 It was just always about the code
我问过他 I asked him
所以你知道她是你的真名吗 so you know is that oh she your real name
你以前做过什么 What have you done before
能告诉我一点关于你自己的事吗 Can tell me a little bit about yourself
他完全无视这一点 And he just ignored that completely
但是回来说 but came back and said
你知道我很高兴有更多经验丰富的程序员帮助我完成这个项目 you know I'm great to have more experienced programmers helping out with the project
你知道有几个问题需要解决 You Know Here's a couple of problems that need to be solved
也许你能帮他们解决问题 Maybe you can help solve them
还有 And Uh
噪音 noise
2011年 And Uh In 2011
我赢了一大笔钱 I was in a big win
有点像业余爱好 sort of just as a hobby
我还不知道该怎么办 I didn't really know what to do on it yet
我想见见所有人 我可以的 I was trying to meet everyone. I could
弄清楚哪些项目会很酷 figure out what projects would be cool to work on.
我是在那年8月和几个月后认识罗杰·维恩的 I met roger veer um sort of in August of that year and a few months later
他向这个人推荐了查理·斯里姆 he recommended to this guy charlie shrimp
一开始就有点紧张 who started bit instant
查理应该雇我做最大的 that that charlie should hire me as the head of marketing for biggest
硬币是有翅膀的现金 and the coin is cash with wings
它是一种能够进行本地交易并在全球范围内进行交易的能力 It's the ability to be able to take a local transaction and do it globally
这就是为什么大钱会颠覆金融基础设施 And That's why big coin is gonna overturn the financial infrastructure
这枚硬币就像是世界上最大的社会经济实验 The coin is like the largest social economic experiment the world has ever seen
我们的谈话范围从你知道平凡和实际 Our conversations would range from you know the mundane and practical
你所知道的那些人的崇高愿望这真的会以一种好的方式改变世界吗 very high minded aspiration of ones you know like is this actually gonna change the world in a good way
我们只是一群不知道我们在说什么的疯子吗 Are we just a bunch of crazy people who don't know what the hell we're talking about
我们真的要开始了吗 are we actually starting to
开创一个在事后看来对每个人都显而易见的行业 initiate an industry which in hindsight will look obvious to everyone
查理·斯里姆在那个舞台上 charlie shrimp was at that stage
比特币界相当知名的人物 a fairly high profile figure in the bit coin community
你知道其中一个大富翁 他赚了很多钱 在管理系统内资金流动的基础设施中发挥了重要作用 and you know one of these big coin uh millionaires who made a lot of money very quickly and really played an important role in the infrastructure of managing the movement of funds around the system
在你知道的初级阶段 In that you know early rudimentary phase
纽约现金市场上比特币的654报价 654 offer in the new york cash market for bit coin
买家将当场支付632美元现金 buyers right now will pay $632 cash on the spot
下一个是谁 为了二十六个五十三中的十一个 who's next? For the big 11 of the twenty six fifty three?
我想这么做 我知道是什么 你知道我肯定什么 我更喜欢 I wanted to do. I know what it is. You Know What I'm for sure. I prefer
美元 dollars.
是的 我说得对 在过去的两周里 Yeah, I have good point. In the last two weeks,
我还有1 3美元 I got 1/3 more dollars.
是从大商场买来的 It was from the big got that great shopping here
去纽约比特币中心 to the new york bit coin center,
你可以一直买卖 you can buy and sell all the time.
是 啊 Yeah,
是 啊 yeah
是 啊 yeah.
中间的桌子 Table in the middle.
是的 就一张小桌子 然后 Yeah Just one small table round and have uh
花就像插花一样 flowers like a flower arrangement,
非常漂亮的插花 a really nice flower arrangement
大玉米 big corn
花 矢车菊 flowers, cornflowers
就在这里 三种颜色 which is right here, three colors
在我们建立第一个大型硬币中心之前 before we're putting together the first uh big coin center
在纽约市 就在纽约证券交易所隔壁 here in new york city, right next door to the new york stock exchange.
比特币是一个新的空间 Bit coin is a new space,
很多规章制度还没有实施 and many of the rules and regulations haven't been imposed
但是 但我们很快就会开门了 yet. But we will open one day soon
律师完成他们的工作后 after the lawyers do their job,
实时数字货币兑换 a live digital currency exchange
有希望地 hopefully,
satoshi似乎承认比特币的发展很难不与美元和欧元的常规经济互动 satoshi seemed to acknowledge that it would be hard for bit coin to develop in any way in which it wasn't interacting with the regular economy of dollars and euros
交换的问题是他们把你带回了比特币真正想要摆脱的旧世界 The problem with exchanges is that they took you back to this old world that bit coin was really trying to get away from
一旦你回到交易所 As soon as you move back to an exchange,
你要回到一个第三方在你身上拥有所有这些个人资料而你却拥有所有金钱的世界 you're moving back to a world in which some 3rd party has all this personal data on u has all of your money
所有的安全漏洞都没有 has all the security vulnerabilities and really has none of those strengths
那枚比特币是用来提供 That bit coin was designed to provide
杰玛·卡莱布有一天晚上在云雀上创造了神像山 因为他买不到他想买的那么快的比特币 Gemma caleb created mount docs essentially on a lark one night because he couldn't buy bit coins as quickly as he wanted to
有趣的是 And Interestingly
他是从一个网址开始的他以前用这个网址来运行魔法卡交易端 he did it by starting with a url that he'd previously used to run uh magic card trading side
所以你知道了其中一些想法是从哪里来的 以及你是如何知道其中一些是基本的 So you get an idea about where some of these ideas are coming from and how you know really kind of rudimentary some of them were
基本上就是把这个网站整合在一起 然后不费吹灰之力地放到网上 Jet essentially through this site together and put it online without too much thought
比我想象的要快得多 much faster than I thought it would
钱的问题有很多法律风险 there's a there's a lot of legal risk around of money
传输系统确实把它卖给了他找到的第一个人 Transmissions did essentially sold it to the first person he found
谁是马克·卡尔宫殿 who was mark karr palace
一个住在东京的法国人 a French guy who was living in Tokyo
当他决定把马克卖给他时 他对他知之甚少 He really knew very little about mark when he decided to sell it to him
它的生长速度比马克预期的或准备的要快得多 it began growing much more quickly than mark was expecting or was prepared for
他还在查呢 Uh He's still running it
但是 But
但它还在继续 but it's still going,
是 啊 yeah,
噪音 noise
噪音 noise.
系统中有2100万比特币将被释放 There are 21 million bit coins programmed into the system that are going to be released
是固定的号码 Its a set number
但在那里面 but within that
每一个比特币都可以分成一亿个不同的碎片 every single bit coin can be divided up into a hundred million different pieces
所以它有空间随着用途的扩大而扩大 So there's room for it to expand as the use expands
尤其是在发展中国家的新兴市场 especially in the emerging markets in the developing world
那真是最有趣的地方 That is really the most interesting place to see where this thing goes
所以在我口袋里 So in my pocket
我有津巴布韦储备银行的十万亿津巴布韦元 I have hundred trillion zimbabwe dollars from the reserve bank of zimbabwe
我们的政府搞砸了我们的钱 our governments screw up our money.
你知道津巴布韦是一个很好的例子 一个政府的例子 You Know Zimbabwe is a good example, of a of a government
失去了人民的信任 that lost the trust of their people
恶性通货膨胀 hyperinflation
银行倒闭的人会认为他们是在找东西的人 bank failures think those will be the kind of people who are looking for something,
新东西 正确的 他们愿意冒这个险 something new. Right? They're willing to take the risk.
我们很多人都有能力给别人寄钱 A lot of us take the capacity to send money to to others
收钱 receive money
把钱存起来 这些天用电子方式来做是理所当然的 store money, and do it electronically these days for granted
因为我们是世界上50%左右有银行账户的幸运儿之一 Because we are amongst the lucky fifty percent or so of the world that have bank accounts
但是世界上有25亿成年人没有银行账户 But two point five billion adults in the world do not have access to bank accounts
像大硬币加密货币这样的技术有能力把这些人带进金融系统 让他们有能力有效地拥有你可以说是银行在他们手机里的东西 A technology like big coin crypto currency has the capacity to to bring those people into the financial system to give them this power to effectively have what you could argue is a bank in their cell phone
真的可以为很多现在被排除在外的人开放商业 really could open up commerce to a lot of people who are currently excluded from it
可能在一个国家工作的人 Somebody who is maybe working in one country,
你知道他们想寄钱回家 and you know they want to send money back home.
现在呢 And Right now
从西方联盟的角度看 from a western union perspective
我们为全球各地的客户提供服务 主要为汇款服务 We serve clients in many different locations around the globe and on primarily for remittances
西联银行通常为修女银行客户提供服务 这些客户要么是外来务工人员 要么是在金融服务行业感到不自在的个人 Western union serves typically a nun bank customer customer who is either a migrant uh worker or a individual who doesn't feel comfortable in the financial services sector
还有汇款的问题 And the problem with remittances
它们真的很贵 they're really expensive
我可能会花上五到十块钱只是为了你知道把钱还给我的家人 I may end up spending five or $10 just on fees to you know get that money back to my family
如果你贫穷又工作 那是很大的一部分 That's a huge percentage if you're poor and working
既然比特币不在乎国界 So since bit coin doesn't care about borders
去另一个国家 to another country
只是 uh and it's just
更快更便宜更方便 quicker and cheaper and more convenient
很多人认为汇款将是女王的第一大用途之一 And a lot of people think that remittances will be one of the really big first uses for the queen
我们面临的一个挑战是你知道我们的公司 The one Challenge there is we deal with you know our companies
每秒七五十笔交易 Seven and 50 transactions peek a second
这些都是瞬间发生的 and those happen instantly
如果你看一个区块链 If you look at a block chain
你必须等待核实 you have to wait for verification
赞 如果你最近做了个测试 Zan if you do a recent test
每一笔交易都需要15分钟才能通过网络验证 it takes about 15 minutes for every transaction to be validated by the network
这是不可伸缩的 所以它也有它的挑战 That doesn't scale. So it has its challenges as well.
嗯 Well
维基泄密 wiki leaks
向世界各地的告密者索取和发布秘密和被压制的材料 which solicits and publishers secrets and suppressed material from whistleblowers around the world
它受到了想要关闭它的政府的网络攻击 It's been under cyber attack from governments that want to shut it down
贝宝是最新一家与维基泄密断绝关系的公司 Paypal is the latest business to break ties with wiki leaks
但专门发布政府机密文件的揭发网站仍在继续寻求资金 同时也在横扫 but the whistle blowing website dedicated to publishing classified government documents still continues to seek funding while crossing out
为了确保我们未来的生存 in order to ensure our future survival.
维基泄密现在被迫暂时暂停所有发布操作 Wiki leaks is now forced to temporarily suspend all publishing operations
为了把我们所有的资源都投入到对抗封锁和提高电话的使用上 in order to direct all our resources into fighting the blockade and raising phones
维基泄密丑闻似乎提供了一个赚大钱的机会 The wiki leaks scandal seemed to provide an opportunity for big coin
当时 At the time
大银行和信用卡停止处理维基泄密的付款 the big banks and credit cards stopped processing payments for wiki leaks
比特币将提供一种向维基解密发送捐款的方式 bit coin would provide a way to send donations to wiki leaks
噪音 noise.
你可以在维基联盟的喧嚣中看到 And Uh You could certainly see in the hubbub around wiki leagues that said toe
政府和政府走得太近了 the government and the government coming in and taking too close
看看维克的一个项目 你也可以看到就是这样 A look at vic one project and you could also see that's it
大硬币 the big coin
当时还是个年轻的软件 国王还没出来 was still young software, and the kings hadn't been worked out yet.
我认为2010年末 And I think late 2010
他问我是否可以把我的邮箱地址写在比特币上或者主页上 he asked me if it be okay if he put my EMAIL address on the bit coin dot or homepage
因为他是人们的主要联系人 because he had been the primary contact for people
我说了 Um And I said
当然 sure
他头脑发热 改了网页 he went in head and changed the web page
但他所做的是他把自己的名字留在了那里 And But what he did is he he he left his name there
他拿走了他的邮箱地址 He took away his EMAIL address.
所以只有我和我的邮箱地址突然引起了大家的注意 And So it was just me and my EMAIL address who was suddenly getting all of the attention
我想她是在说你知道你是这个项目的领导者 And I think that was that oh she's way of kind of saying you know you're the you're the leader of the project
现在 Now
有一封特别的邮件 他告诉我他要离开这个项目去做别的事情 There was one particular EMAIL where he told me that he was gonna step away from the project and do something else
他会做或者他正在做的事 he's gonna do or that he is doing
我告诉satoshi我接受了去中情局演讲的邀请 and I told satoshi that I accepted the invitation to go speak at the CIA.
在他把那封邮件发给set之后 after he sent that EMAIL to set
她跟他说他打算去中情局 oh she telling him that he was planning on going to the CIA
他再也没有satoshi的消息了 He never heard from satoshi again
那基本上是最后一次了 And that was essentially the last time
有satoshi的消息吗 Anybody heard from satoshi
你很快就会被问到谁是中本佐藤 You very quickly get caught up in the question of who is satoshi nakamoto
这是从哪来的 Where did this come from
这个人是谁 Who is this person
我是说这是两千条信息 I mean this is the two thousands Information is out there
每个人都知道每个人的一切 Everything everyone knows everything about everybody
怎么可能有一个人没人知道他是谁 How can there possibly be a person that nobody knows who this guy is
但有个人至少我觉得是一个人 But there is a person with at least I think it's a person
可能是一群没人知道这家伙是谁的人 It might be a group who nobody knows who this guy is
他在2008年突然出现在这些密码学邮件列表上这个系统叫做比特币 he kind of appears out of nowhere in 2008 on these cryptography EMAIL lists with this system called bit coin
他很活跃 He's very active
早年 In the early years
他经常和人交流 there's a lot of back and forth with him communicating with people
似乎大多数人都把他拒之门外了 It seemed like most people kind of wrote him off
似乎从一开始就对他很感兴趣他是个秘密理想主义者 就像他一样 seem to be really interested right from the beginning he was a crypto idealist, like he
不像其他赛弗朋克那样愤世嫉俗 was not as kind of cynical as many of the other cypher punks
所以他真的很投入他开始和她交谈所以他所说的中本看起来像是一个年轻的日裔美国人尾声芬尼是第一个和中本一起工作的人 So he got really into this he started talking to so she nakamoto who he said seemed like some young Japanese American coda how finny was the first guy to work with nakamoto
他是个密码学家 He was a cryptographer
中本一被释放 他就是第一批回信说这很有趣的人之一 As soon as uh nakamoto released he was one of the first people to EMAIL him back and say this is interesting
我喜欢和你一起工作 I like to work with you
在比特币交易的头几周里 他和他反复合作建立了这个系统 所以她中本送去了健康的比特币交易 And In the first weeks of bit coin he worked with him back and forth setting up the system and so she nakamoto ended up sending healthy neither first ever bit coin transaction
任何关于索托-她身份的讨论都必须追溯到比特币是基于上世纪九十年代的一小部分项目的事实 只有少数人知道这些项目 any discussion of soto she's identity has to go back to the fact that bit coin was based on this small number of projects back in the nineteen nineties that only a handful of people knew about
就像杂碎现金和比特金一样 like hash cash and bit golden be money
所以你最终会遇到一小群人知道这些项目 And So you end up with a pretty small group of people who would have known about these projects
人们认为魅力 People thought charm
大卫·查默 你知道每个人都有这种有趣的心情 David charm was you know everybody in the cypher fun mood
有一次他们说好了他一定是索托她他们都出来否认价格 At one point another they said well he must have been soto she uh they've all come out and denied it price
一个九十年代在加利福尼亚和密码朋克们一起起步的人一个非常擅长密码的人 他懂得密码并且做了一个很好的工作把比特币和任何能识别他的东西分开 Somebody who started out in the nineties in California with the cipher punks somebody who is very very good at cryptography who understands encryption and has done a wonderful job of just separating bit coin from anything that can identify him
我想是为了比特币吧 I think for bit coins sake
参与其中的人可以在这项技术上写下自己的想法和梦想 people who have gotten involved in it have been able to write their own ideas and dreams onto this technology
没有人能说出来 And there was nobody there to say
不 No
我不是这个意思 that's not what I meant
还有早期 And And And And And And the early early days
或多或少有点技术头脑呃代码是 more or less tech minded uh code as
从一到四 from one to four.
然后你让那些自由主义者站出来从政治角度看问题 Then you have the libertarians come on board who saw it through a political lens
我很高兴能参与其中允许和接受比特币 I'm excited to be a little bit of part of it with allowing and accepting bit coin
然后你让这两个小组一起工作他们重叠了两个小组 And then you had these two groups working together and they overlap two
时间安排得很好 因为现有的系统已经完全失修了 And the timing was very good because the existing system was in utter disrepair
它就像是一根高木柴的火柴 上面有汽油 It was like a match to a highly wood with gasoline for on Top of it
整件事真的像病毒一样传播开来 And The whole thing kinda really goes viral and takes off.
然后你就有西装了 And then you have the suits
风投资金 the vc money
一开始很小 and it was very small at first
硅谷的几个家伙在咖啡馆碰到了比特币的家伙然后你就开始聊起了 Just a couple of guys out in silicon valley who ran into bit coin guys at coffee houses and you started having this meshing of conversations
一旦硅谷上市 Once silicon valley gets on board
整个动力开始起飞了 that whole dynamic starts to take off
所以现在你有了自由主义者和反文化人士的科技理念硅谷风投 So now you have the tech minded code as the libertarians a counter culture people the vc silicon valley
你有一大堆人聚集在一起 And you have this entire great mishmash of people coming together
你有网络效应 You had a network effect
参与的人越多 网络就越强大 网络就越发达 The more people that got involved the stronger than network got and the more it grew
它真的开始自己生长了 And it really started growing on itself
2013年 尤其是你会看到蘑菇 And in 2013 especially you you would literally see this thing mushroom.
随着越来越多的人参与进来 事情变得越来越复杂 The thing was just growing growing and growing and growing as more and more people got involved
用过的人 used people.
我想当时大多数比特币公司都知道大币市场的很大一部分是 I think most bit coin companies at the time knew that a big part of the market for big coins was
在丝绸之路上买毒品的人需要零钱来买毒品 people buying drugs on silk road who needed bit coins to do that
是丝绸之路吗 was the silk road
这绝不是普通但可用的加密货币比特币 this by no means common but usable crypto currency called bit coin
他用流线型的 And he married it with streamlined
可行的用户界面 workable user interface
那是一个可以卖任何东西的自由市场 That was a Free market that could sell anything
会发生什么 What would happen
如果人们真的自由了 if people were really Free
真正自由地交换他们想要的东西 truly Free to trade what they wanted to
自由主义者 libertarian
我很想尝试使用技术 viewpoint and really wanted to experiment with using technology
为人们创造自由市场 to create Free markets for people
罗斯·布瑞克的所作所为 What ross all brick did
比特币旅游组合 the combination of tours on bit coin
那一定是罗斯的惊喜时刻 That was the aha moment that ross must have had
丝绸之路基本上是所有密码朋克梦想的成果 The silk road was basically the fruition of all of the cipher punk dreams
他们在九十年代想象的乌托邦 utopia that they had imagined in the nineties
你知道是真的 现在这是一个 you know was real. Now this was a
理论上完美的匿名网站理论上完美的 perfectly in theory anonymous website with perfectly in theory
用来购买任何可以想象的违禁品的匿名资金 anonymous money used to buy any contraband imaginable
丝绸之路网站尤其让当局头疼 The silk road website is a particular headache for authorities
这是一个巨大的在线市场 人们在那里销售药物 这些药物发布到世界各地的客户手中 It's an enormous online marketplace where people sell drugs that are posted to customers all over the world
老网络调查员 Old cyber investigators
你知道有犯罪可以追查到你因为你有IP地址 You Know There's a crime can kind of trace you back because you have an IP address
就像电话号码一样 It's like a telephone number
如果你给另一台电脑打电话 So if you call another computer
因为你的信息从一台电脑跳到另一台电脑而被带走的巡回演出 on tour that's taken away because your Information hops from computer to computer computers
旅游 tour
是一个匿名系统 is an anonymous system.
如果你用tor浏览器 So if you use the tor browser
它有一个浏览器 which has a browser
你可以去激流 you can go to torrent
你可以安全浏览 you can browse with some degree of security
这对把你的银行信息插入网站很有帮助 So that's great for plugging your banking Information into a site
所以你得不到帽子 So you don't get hat
旅游的另一个组成部分也有类似的用途 The other component of tour which is has similar uses
被称为隐藏服务 is called tor hidden services
实际上是 is actually
简单地说 没有网络的区域 uh to put it simply, AU r l that doesn't have dot com
最后 On the end
有点洋葱味 it has dot onion
这是它自己的一个小空间 你可以创建网站 在没有监督和监管的情况下自由交易 And that is it's own little space where you can create websites and you could freely transact without oversight or regulation
人们把网站放在那里 People put websites on there
他们不在执法部门的范围内 他们雇佣那些黑客 They are outside of law enforcement view those hackers for hire
信用卡转储服务 credit card dump services
有很多人 there is a whole bunch of them
过去几年的数字犯罪调查员 digital crime investigator of the last few years
他就是那个从本质上摧毁匿名者的人 He was the one who took down anonymous essentially
所以我们决定开始看一些巡回演出的服务作为其中的一员我们很自豪 So we decided to start looking at some of the services on tour and so proud being one of them
其他的案子他们会打巡回赛然后把手伸进去说是巡回赛 Other cases they would hit tour and they would kind of throw their hands in there and say it's tour
我们无能为力 There's not much we can do about it
我觉得看一眼就能搞定它很有趣 I found it interesting to kind of take a look at it and tackle it.
但瞬间基本上诞生了 But instant was basically born
因为如果你想把你的钱转移到一个大的交易所 Because if you want to move your dollars into a big one exchange
你至少要知道三天 it takes you know at least three days
现在考克斯在东京的主要交易所 可能需要一周或更长时间 the major exchange now cox was in Tokyo, it could take a week or more.
所以这很有问题 So that's really problematic
基本上 Um And basically
如果你只是持有美元的余额 if you just held a balance of dollars
在交易所 at the exchange,
你可以去找他说 查理 我给你一百美元 you could go to him and say, charlie, i'll give you $a hundred.
你能在交易所给我一百美元的信用卡吗 Will you give me $a hundred of credit at the exchange?
然后你就可以在10秒内而不是一周内把你的美元汇到交易所 And You can literally then have your dollars at the exchange in 10 seconds as opposed to a week
所以这通常是有帮助的 So that's usually helpful
尤其是当大硬币如此不稳定的时候 especially when big coin is so volatile
你需要知道你会得到什么价格 And you need to know exactly what price you're gonna get
查理在筹集资金呃 作家 Charlie was raising capital uh writers
有点像我在那个过程中加入的 sort of I I joined during that process
他遇到了很多感兴趣的投资者 他们开始觉得这场大获全胜可能很酷 He came across lots of interested investors who were starting to get a whiff that maybe this big win thing was was cool
我们很早就有过一场有趣的辩论我们投资比特币还是比特币公司 We had an interesting debate early on about um do we invest in bit coin or bit coin companies
决定在早期更倾向于投资一大笔钱 decided to um both more towards investing in actually big coin in the acid early days,
但同时也试图在生态系统中下注以支持公司对企业家的支持 but also trying to place a few bets in the ecosystem to support the company's support the entrepreneurs
看看结果如何 um and and see how that went.
在他们第一次发现比特币的几天后 A few days after they first found out about bit coin
埃里克和查理基本上是通过比特币和他们交谈并回答了他们所有的问题和担忧 eric and charlie uh essentially talk them through bit coin and answered all of their questions and concerns
是什么让你在那一刻投资的 What made you invest in that instant
交易所和网站上有很多公司对比特币的监管显然是个大问题 There are a lot of companies on exchanges and websites with respect to bit coin regulation is obviously a big question
你真正想要的是一家重视这一点并理解技术因素的公司 What you do want is a company that sort of takes that seriously and understands that there's the technology element
公司正在建设中 Um There's building the company
另外还有一家公司与监管机构合作 And then there's also creating the company that works with regulators
所以那是瞬间的 And so that's been instant
这不是完全地下的东西 It's It's not this sort of completely underground thing
我是说首席执行官查理在太空呆了很长时间 I mean charlie the CEO happens to have been in the space for a long time
所以他有点精力充沛 so he's sort of on the pulse and the cutting edge
你知道你出来说我们想让这个大指头颠覆一切 You Know You come out and you say like we want this big pointing to overturn everything
但同时我们也要抱怨 But at the same time we have to be complaint
我们必须知道你必须了解你的客户 And we have to know you have to know your customer
你必须了解每一位顾客 you have to know every single customer
即使他们转移一美元或一千美元 even if they're transferring a dollar or thousand dollars
这有多合理 And how reasonable is that
洗钱这个词是银行发明的 The term money laundry was invented by banks
知道你的顾客不该这么复杂 这么贵 And knowing your customer shouldn't be this complicated, expensive thing
你应该像对待罪犯一样对待每个人 开始 And You should treat everyone like a criminal. The beginning
他们真的想让我们参与进来 they really wanted us involved
社区在某种程度上也是自私自利 community and it's also in in some ways it's it's self serving that way
大多数美国人都能买到比特币 most americans were able to buy bit coins.
在这里 它是 Here. It is.
所以比特瞬间就在那里 So bit instant was located right there.
我想是现在说眨眼的那个 I think it's the one that now says blink.
那是一阵旋风 六个月 It was a whirlwind. Six months
从默默无闻到 going from total obscurity with
因为没钱成为你认识的一家大公司 with no money to becoming you know one of the hot startups of a big coin.
但就在双胞胎投资公司的时候 But almost as soon as the twins made their investment in the company
它开始崩溃了 it began falling apart
这对双胞胎对比特币和比特瞬间有更实际的方法 The twins had a much more practical approach to bit coin and bit instant
他们想看到公司赚钱 赚尽可能多的钱 They wanted to see the company making money and making as much money as it could
尽快 as quickly as it could
他们很早就意识到这将受到监管 They saw early on that it would be regulated
没人有兴趣管理它吗 have no one be interested in regulating it
什么都做不了的地方 where nothing would ever get done
所以他们想帮助推动监管 这样无论什么监管都能起作用 最终都不会完善 So they wanted to help drive the regulation so that whatever regulation would be there would work and would not end up being uh Complete
死胡同 Dead end
从纯粹的商业角度来看 这个策略更明智 That strategy is smarter from purely a business perspective
但我不是单纯从商业角度来看的 But I'm not in this purely from a business perspective
在公司之间建立联系 乞求与引发诸多问题的银行监管完全匹配的监管 and building between companies and begging for regulation that matches exactly the banking regulation that has caused so many problems
我觉得这会适得其反 Um I feel like it's counterproductive
大部分情况下 For the most part
确保人们不会将服务用于非法目的 to make sure that people weren't using the service for illegal purposes
但是查理在处理BT寻求时犯了个错误 他承认自己知道BT寻求是在做什么 But charlie made the mistake in dealing with BT seeking of acknowledging that he knew who what BT seeking was doing
他正在收集比特币卖给丝绸之路的顾客 and that he was acquiring bit coins to sell them to silk road customers
在这种情况下 In this case
查理和那家伙一起工作 写了一些邮件 基本上承认他知道这家伙在干什么 charlie worked with the guy and wrote emails that essentially acknowledged he knew what this guy was up to
哦 Oh,
休斯敦大学 uh
是 啊 yeah,
那个令人震惊的人逮捕了一个叫恐怖海盗罗伯茨·皮尔斯的毒枭 他垄断了网络毒品市场 that stunning arrested the drug kingpin who goes by the name dread pirate roberts pierce of cornered the internet drug market
他的真名是罗斯 His real name is ross
他网站上的所有砖块 all brick on his website
里面装着可卡因和海洛因之类的东西 is packed with products like cocaine and heroin
支付系统是通过比特币实现的 比特币基本上是数字货币 没有任何国际银行的支持 也没有任何美国银行的支持 The payment system is all through bit coins which is basically digital currency not backed up by any international banks not backed up by any US banks
但这仅仅是基于电脑与电脑交换比特币的用户的信心 but simply based on the confidence of the users who exchange these bit coins computer to computer
这案子在纽约审理是有原因的 There's a reason why the case was tried in new york
在南部地区 in the in the southern district
很大程度上是因为比特币 and largely that was because of bit coin
罗斯在旧金山被捕了 Ross was caught in san francisco,
丝绸之路的服务器不在国内 the silk road servers were out of the country.
为什么罗斯在纽约南区受审 So why was ross is case tried in the southern district of new york,
大部分金融监管案件都是在这里处理的 where most of the financial regulations cases are dealt with
地方检察官准备的地方 where the district attorney prepare
在比特币上到处都是R a 查尔斯·舒默 R a has been all over bit coin where charles schumer
参议员 the senator
一直都是小钱 has been all a bit coin
罗斯·乌尔布里希特的案子是个小案子 Ross ulbricht case is a bit coin case
丝绸之路对市场的威胁程度 the the level of threat that the silk road posed to the marketplace
无论是感知到的威胁还是实际的威胁都是巨大的 whether it's a perceived threat or an actual threat was humongous.
如果有人能创造一个市场 让你在没有监督和监管的情况下自由交易 那就必须受到一场大规模的公开打击 And the idea that somebody could create a marketplace where you could freely transact without oversight or regulation had to be dealt a massive and public blow it queen kind of
货币化 monetize that
互联网的匿名部分使得交易联邦政府不希望你交易的东西成为可能 anonymous part of the internet made it possible to trade in things that federal government doesn't want you to trade it
执法行动缓慢 Law enforcement moves slowly
但它是一个大而重的轮子终于磨碎了 but it's it's a big heavy wheel that grinds finally
有人在暗中执行任务 现在他们终身监禁 uh someone was running a hidden service and now they're in prison for life
他们在玩硬球 They were playing hardball
很明显他们的意图是 It was very evident that their intention
正如法官自己在判决中所说的那样 as the judge herself said in her sentencing
是为了给罗斯做个榜样就是告诉你们所有人使用比特币给你们所有人 was to make an example out of ross was to say to all of you people using bit coin to all of you
市场和技术以及开源的加密货币 um market places and technologies and open source you know crypto currencies
我们会把整本书扔给你 如果你这么做了 We will throw the book in its entirety at you. If you do this,
我们缴获了一大堆比特币 we seized a whole bunch of bit coins
为了卖掉那些硬币或者去交易所 And in order to sell those bit coins off or or go to an exchange
你必须符合联邦法律和州法律 you have to fit within federal law and state law
没有一个真正的交易所能处理这个问题 There's not really an exchange that could handle that that that
当时符合那些规定 Met those regulations at the current time
所以必须通过期权来处理 So it had to be handled through option
呃呃呃 uh uh uh
呃 uh the
你知道我觉得那是硬币 you know I think that bit coins
今天华尔街日报上有篇文章 There's an article in the wall street journal today
比特币真的 bit coins really
就在这里 right here.
看吧 Read it is
数字货币 你看到了吗 digital currency. Do you see that oh
数字货币将扰乱全球金融 digital currencies will disrupt global finance
也许能让世界变得公平 and just maybe make the world a fair place
从我在电脑上看到的 From what I read on the computer
他们遇到了一些问题 就说 they have had some problems and just say
这是毒贩的手 here it's a hand for drug dealers
是的 是的 Yeah Yeah,
真 的 wow.
原因是你无法追踪 The reason is because you can't track it.
我觉得我一点都不喜欢这个主意 Well I think I don't like this idea at all.
是 啊 Yeah.
当我们看到丝绸之路关闭时 When we saw the silk road shutdown
很多人说你知道比特币 a lot of people said you know bit coins
网上除了非法毒品什么都没有 nothing but illegal drugs on the internet
就是这样 That's what it is
他们会指着丝绸之路说 And they would point at the silk road and say
看看这里发生的一切 look here at all the stuff that's happening here
我想当你看到丝绸之路的关闭和比特币交易量时 And I think when you saw the silk road shutdown and bit coin transaction volume
然后继续往上走 and then keep going up.
你知道吗 我觉得那是一件很好的事情 你可以说 你知道那不是真的 You Know I think that was that was a great event to point at and say you know it it really wasn't
关于那件事 about that
不是因为这个 It really isn't about that
你知道这只是经济的一小部分 You Know It's a tiny little part of the economy
但我长大了 but brought up better
但我觉得不会的 But I think it'll be didn't get it
最近我听到一个场景 联邦调查局没收了一堆你非法使用的大硬币 recently I heard a scenario after the FBI had seized a bunch of big coins you to do illegal as actions
一艘私人游艇 是某个毒贩给你的 那么 a private yacht for you know from some drug dealer. Uh So
在某种程度上使它作为一种货币的使用合法化 that in a way legitimizes the use of it as a currency
噪音 noise
看起来像 这是第一次现场直播 looks like. It's the first live
有点 华尔街的外汇交易 bit. Foreign exchange on wall street
看那边 looks that way.
噪音 Noise.
九百分之一吧 So one for 900
没有卖家 by no sellers
现在我们要看的是在大型货币交易所地板上的未平仓债券 Right now we are looking at the open interest at the floor of the big coin exchange
网上有不同的交易所会提出出价和要求 There's different exchanges that are online that will present the bid and ask
公开叫卖交易所买卖双方以公开的价格 透明的 诚实的方式走到一起 open outcry exchange buyers and sellers coming together in an open dollier transparent honest way
盒子109百年 box 109 hundred years,
是 啊 yeah,
噪音 noise
噪音 noise.
我的交易在哪 Where is my transaction
可能是今天前两笔交易 Probably the first two transactions of the day
不是钱的问题 It's It's really not about the money
是为了参与其中 It's about being involved
我想会有更多的人跟着我 And I think there's a lot more people are gonna follow me
查理·夏普 Charlie sharpe
24岁 今天被捕 被控洗钱 24 years old, arrested today and charged with engaging in money laundering
Sram使人们能够将比特币上的钱转换成现金 Um Sram enabled people to transfer money from bit coin to cash
他的公司叫比特即时 His company called bit instant
丝绸之路是个贩卖人口的网站 silk road was a trafficking website
我们认识温克尔老大双胞胎显然我们在关于脸谱网的电影里出现过 And we know the winkle boss twins to obviously we're featured in the movie about Facebook
他们实际上是投资者和虾公司 They're actually investors and shrimps company
是 啊 Yeah
你知道很多人对这个想法很兴奋 You Know A lot of people are very excited by this idea
他们喜欢这样的想法 即你可以拥有一种与任何一种中央银行都无关的货币 They like the idea that you can have a currency that is not tied to any kind of central bank
但同时我是说想想看 But at the same time I mean think about it
如果你是联邦政府的话 if you're in the federal government
你不喜欢人们可以用另一种形式的现金购买不应该在网上购买的东西 you don't like the idea that people could effectively use another form of cash to buy things that they shouldn't be buying online
我是什么 What's me?
不全是我的顾客 是一个顾客 Uh It wasn't all my customers. It was one customer
在十几万顾客中 这是一个顾客 out of about a hundred thousand customers. This was one customer.
有一件事是我向参议员提出的 One thing I made that case to my senator
我说了画努尔 I said draw nur
这是一个顾客 this was one customer
真的发生了 it happened literally
我从阿姆斯特丹回来的时候穿着运动衫 I was coming home from amsterdam was my sweatshirt
我还是被石头砸了 I was still stoned
我不知道怎么回事 I don't know what's going on
查理不知道什么时候该闭嘴 Charlie did not know when to shut up
还有那个 and that
结果给他惹上麻烦 可能导致公司倒闭 ended up getting him in trouble and probably lead to the end of his company
但他们让我加入了爱国者法案这是洗钱因为我知道我拿的钱 But they got me into the patriot act and it's money laundering because I knew that the money I was taking
最终可能会被用于贩毒 was eventually possibly going to be used for drug trafficking
贩毒不是买卖毒品 And drug trafficking is not buying drugs and selling drugs
我没有卖毒品的人 I don't have the drug seller
我帮他买毒品 I help the guy buy drugs
但我从来没上过庭因为 but I never went to trial because
我认罪是因为谁在审判中获胜 and I pled guilty because who wins at trial?
你知道吗 这家伙的丝绸之路不是一条生路 You Know Like this guy's silk road isn't a go to life
在审判中 And In trial
我要找的是一位女士 她儿子死于可卡因过量我会让陪审团在那里判我有罪的 I need to get it was a lady who son died from a cocaine overdose and I would have the jury would have convicted me right there
所以本质上查理是在把比特币卖给一个把女王的卖给那些 So essentially charlie was selling bit coins to a guy who was selling the queen's to people who were
把毒品放进他们自己的身体里 putting drugs into their own bodies.
为了这个 Um And for this
查理被控的罪行可能会让他入狱20年 charlie was charged with crimes that could have put him in jail for 20 years
这就是检察官开枪的目的 That's what the prosecutors were shooting for
我们有 We have
在美国每个街角都有一支队伍的银行 banks that have a team is on every street corner in America
那些银行很清楚这些钱被用来买毒品了 And those banks know very well that that cash is getting used for drugs
但是 没关系 他们可以这么做 没人惹麻烦 And Yet. That's fine. They're allowed to do that. No one gets in trouble.
但是查理把大硬币卖给一个把大硬币卖给吸毒的人的人 But charlie sells big coin to a guy who sells big coin to someone who uses drugs
他进了监狱 And he goes to jail
他是一个创业者开始建立这个产业 He was an entrepreneur that started uh building this industry
当银行家们差点毁掉世界经济时 when bankers almost destroyed the world economy,
他们都没有 and none of them
有麻烦了 got in trouble whatsoever.
这里有一个23岁的孩子 他进了监狱 And Here we have this 23 year old kid. He goes to jail
因为他 because he
开始建立替代方案 started building an alternative
噪音 noise.
是 啊 Yeah.
在过去的六个月里 Over the last six months
我们的机构对虚拟货币进行了广泛的调查 our agency has been conducting an extensive inquiry into virtual currency
我们在这次调查中收集到的信息将使我们能够提出 The Information we're gonna gather in this fact finding effort will allow us to put forward
提议的纽约虚拟货币公司监管框架 a proposed regulatory framework for virtual currency firms operating in new york
昨天 Yesterday
呃 贩毒 uh drug trafficking
以及其他重罪 and other major felonies
马上 Right now
仍然类似于一个虚拟的蛮荒西部 is still akin to a virtual wild west.
这就是为什么我们要评估我们的机构是否应该发布一个专门针对虚拟货币的所谓比特许可证 That's why we're evaluating whether our agency should issue a so called bit license specifically tailored to virtual currencies
我认为人们想象一个非常强大的实用工具 比如硬币 会完全逃脱监管 I think people who imagine a very powerful utility like that coin that would somehow escape regulation entirely
是 are
要么天真要么极端乐观 either naive or extreme optimist.
女王是一场思想之战 The queen is a battle of ideas
它还迫使人们在处理金钱问题上是否应该像处理言论 宗教或人际关系时一样自由 and it forces the issue of whether people should be as Free in their handling of money as they are in their handling of speech or religion or relationships with each other
如果你想让这件事成为主流 If you want to have this thing go mainstream
你必须有监管机构 you're going to have to have the regulators
立法者也参与其中 the lawmakers weigh in on it
最早真正感兴趣的是本杰明·劳 And one of the first ones who really took an interest was benjamin law
2014年1月 And In January 2014
举行公开听证会是因为他想为比特币公司申请执照 holds these public hearings because he wants to come up with a license for bit coin companies
我们相信 为虚拟货币设立适当的监管保障措施 最终将有利于行业自身的长期发展 We believe that putting in place appropriate regulatory safeguards for virtual currencies will ultimately be beneficial to the long term strength of the industry itself
迷路的 lost
他基本上有机会从头开始为这个新行业制定规则 He was essentially given the opportunity to write the rules for this whole new industry from scratch
第一个问题是每个人都会想到的一个显而易见的问题 The first question is the obvious one that's on everyone's mind
昨天有点出乎意料 It sort of unexpected yesterday
但我们看到的逮捕行动 But with the arrests we saw
明显地 obviously
这个行业现在有点阴云密布 that's uh put a bit of a cloud hanging over the industry right now
你们每个人对我们昨天看到的有什么反应 how do each of you react to what we saw yesterday
比特币或虚拟货币的含义及其未来 what it means for bit coin or virtual currency and its future
我认为它进一步支持这一点 嗯 I think it further supports that. Um
坏人会做坏事 他们会利用一切可用的技术 bad guys are gonna do bad things and they're gonna use whatever technology is available to them
但我认为这些指控是真的而且他们被定罪了 Um But I view it as the allegations are true and they're convicted
系统工作正常 The system works
人们还在用比特币做坏事吗 Are people still doing bad things with bit coin
当然大多数比特币活动都不是偶然的 Sure is the majority of the bit coin activity vice not a chance
所以我认为你提出的问题是一个人们喜欢写的关于媒体喜欢写的新闻标题 So I think the issue you raise is one um that people like to write about the media likes to write about makes great headlines
点击率很高 You get a lot of clicks
比特币界有些人从自由主义的角度来看 there are some people in the bit coin community from the libertarian side of things that
希望政府不要管它 want government to just leave it alone
你认为监管是不可避免的吗 Would you say regulation is both inevitable
但更重要的是 but more importantly
实际上对虚拟货币的生存至关重要 actually ultimately going to be crucial for the survival of virtual currency
听起来是个糟糕的主意 Sounds like a terrible idea to me
你只要明白我们想用大的做什么就行了 Uh Just understand what we're trying to do with big one
交易可以全球转移的地方 where transactions can move globally
免费的 好的 还有 for Free. Ok And
让这些公司雇佣你知道一些外包合规公司是个坏主意 in making these companies hire you know some out source compliance firm is is a bad idea
在任何行业都会很棒的 It'd be great in any industry
我们可以选择不投资公司 We may choose not to invest in a company
如果 if
你不能给他们执照 they can't get licensed by you,
如果最终的选择是 if the choice ultimately is between
一方面防止洗钱 preventing money laundering on the one hand
我甚至不应该用洗钱这个词因为这个词太好了 and I probably even shouldn't use the word money laundering because it's too nice a word
洗钱是为各种可怕的犯罪提供便利 我想在座的每个人都不想看到这些犯罪发生 money laundering is the facilitation of all kinds of horrific crimes that I think everyone in this room never wants to see happen
资助恐怖主义行为 Acts of terrorism funding
流氓国家 rogue nations
等 etc
都是通过大规模洗钱来实现的 All take place through massive money laundering
或者允许另一方面的创新 or permit uh innovation on the other
我们总是会选择压制洗钱活动 We're always going to choose squelching the money laundering
弗斯特 First
我同意我不认为有人想洗钱 嗯 Um I I agree that that I don't think anybody wants money laundering. Um
当我们让他第一次看到大硬币的时候你知道大概一年半 是两年前 when we got him first saw big coin you know about a year and a half and was two years ago
我想没人会否认这一点 I don't think anybody would deny that
这里有点偏僻 因为没有规定 It was a bit of a wild west because there was no regulation
资产 the asset
评估公司 确定谁合规 谁不合规 evaluate companies, determine who was compliant, who was not
狂野的西部吸引着牛仔 Um And wild west you know attracts cowboys
我觉得这里没人会不同意治安官是件好事 And I don't think anybody here uh would disagree with the fact that a sheriff would be a good thing
很多我认为企业家觉得他们必须自我审查 A lot of I think the entrepreneurs feel like they have to self censor
他们不想公开批评规章制度 They don't want to come out vocally critical of the regulations
其中一部分原因可能是因为他们中的一些人和规章制度一模一样 Part of that is maybe because some of them just like regulations
但我觉得还有一部分 But I think another part of it
如果监管者反对他们 他们会注意的 attention of the regulators if they come out against them
是的 我们希望他们创新 Yes We want them to innovate
但同时 But at the same time
呃 继续洗钱 um uh money laundering to go on
我认为监管机构应该给女王一点时间 让她在监管过度的情况下成长 I think regulators should give the queen some time to grow up too much regulation
现在我们只会扼杀创新 Now we'll just stifle innovation
有点进来说我们会解决你所有的问题但却没能解决我们所有的问题 kind of come in and say we're gonna solve all your problems and then fail to solve all our problems
我认为他们应该给创新者时间来解决这些问题 I think they should give the innovators time to solve those problems
监管的一个功能就是让事情现在变得更清楚 One function of regulation is to make things clearer so right now
大硬币 big coin
因为它太新了 到处都在变化 because it's so new, is in a state of flux everywhere
互联网的教训是中国禁止投资的任何东西 The lesson from the internet is anything that China bans invest in.
好吗 Oh Okay?
这是个玩笑 Uh And Uh That's a joke
但美国允许谷歌在这里运营 But um the US allows Google to operate here
允许推特在这里运行 allows Twitter to operate here
允许比特币在这里运行 allows bit coin to operate here
允许Facebook在这里运行 allows Facebook to operate here
中国政府根本不允许这些公司按照他们在中国的运营方式运营 Chinese government doesn't allow any of those companies to operate the way they operate in this country or at all
是关于自由的 Uh It's about freedom
最终 不 我们是 ultimately. No, we're
离旧世界贸易中心50码 50 yards from the old world trade center here
我想我们都不想再看到这样的事情发生了 And I think all of us never wanna see anything like that happen again
如果911没发生过的话就更难了 And it would have been a lot harder for 911 never have occurred
想杀了这屋子里的所有人 所以呃呃 uh wanna kill everybody in this room. So Um Uh
我认为关键是不要建立无用的规则 I think the key is to not create useless regulation
我们不会错过什么的 再一次 uh we don't miss something. Again.
从2001年开始 有这个 Since 2001. There's this
对恐怖主义的荒谬痴迷 absurd obsession with terrorism
当然不行了 Well Of Course It can't
什么都可以 手机也可以 网络和汽车都可以 So can anything so can cell phones and so can the internet and soak in a car
这并不意味着我们应该知道仅仅因为坏人可以利用它就扼杀了那些行业的发展 Uh It doesn't mean that we should you know stifle the growth of those industries just because bad people can use it
噪音 noise,
噪音 noise
噪音 noise.
这周无疑是加密货币最糟糕的一周 This has arguably been the worst week in the crypto currency
短暂的生命 short life
被曾经占主导地位的交易所崩盘所刺痛 戈斯山 stung by the collapse of once dominant exchange, mount goss
现在失败的公司首席执行官马科埃利斯躲起来了 Now that failed firm CEO ma cop ellis is in hiding
大约75万比特硬币据称被盗或丢失 Some 750000 bit coins allegedly stolen or lost
约占总发行量的6% which accounts for about 6% of the total circulation
休斯敦大学 Uh
当考克斯山倒下的时候 by the time mount cox went down
它的客户认为它持有价值约5亿美元的比特币和公司的大币 it was holding what its customers believed were about a half a billion dollars worth of their bit coins and the company's big coins
它不再是世界上最大的交易所了 It was no longer the largest exchange in the world
即使在发生了许多事件之后 我们也清楚地意识到公司没有能力保护这笔钱 even after there had been numerous incidents in which it was clear that the company was not up to the task of safeguarding the money
我也是 Me too
噪音 noise.
唯一的原因就是他活了这么久 And The only reason he survived as long as he did
是因为2013年 was because in 2013
价格开始上涨 the price started going up
人们一直往里面投钱 People kept putting money into it
他越来越有钱了 因为价格在上涨 He had more and more money because the price is going up
但一旦价格开始下降 But as soon as the price started going down
事情就是这样的 and this is what happened
正确的 right
2013年末达到顶峰2014年开始下降 It peaks in late 2013 starts coming down in 2014
价格一开始下跌 他就大跌 Soon as that price started coming down, it it all just tumbled for him.
上帝会崩溃的 God's was going to collapse
它能持续多久其实是命运的安排 That it lasted as long as it did was actually kind of a stroke of fate
但公平地说没有比这更无聊的了 But it's fairly was it didn't have the kind of more boring
主流的制度控制 我们需要把它提升到一个新的水平 mainstream institutional controls that we require to bring it to the next level
还有 And Uh
有一大笔钱不见了 there's a whole bunch of money missing
没人知道是不是丢了 and no one knows if they just lost it
呃 挪用了 或者什么 但码头的重要教训是 uh embezzled it, or what. But the important lesson from docks
那枚大硬币不管用吗 isn't that big coin doesn't work.
从盒子里得到的重要教训是 你不能把钱留给可信的第三方 因为你不能总是信任他们 Important lesson from boxes that you don't leave your money with a trusted 3rd party because you can't always trust them
你只能相信他们直到你不能 You can only trust them until you can't
这也是金融危机期间人们应该吸取的教训 但是 This was also a lesson that people were supposed to learn during the financial crisis, but
他们好像还没学会 they don't seem to have learned it yet.
噪声 Noise
马克宫是个玩家 他不是金融专家 marker palace was a gamer. He was not a finance Pro.
他真的不知道自己在做什么 He really didn't know what he was doing
他没有他没有造飞机 And he didn't he didn't build a jet
马凯拉建造了它 Makayla built it
他没有进步 He didn't improve upon it
我是说它在整个历史中从一个危机发展到另一个危机 I mean it lurched from crisis to crisis throughout the entire history
去年是糟糕的一年 Last year was a terrible year
对比特币来说 尤其是对基金会来说 糟糕的一年因为她有两个人在我们的董事会 uh for bit coin and especially terrible year for the foundation because she had two of the people on our board of
不得不丢脸辞职的董事们 基本上 directors who had to resign in disgrace. Basically
你知道我的专长是技术 Um You Know My My expertise is technology
值得信赖的人 who's trustworthy
谁不知道 你知道哪些生意会成功 哪些生意会失败 who's not, you know which businesses are gonna succeed, which businesses are gonna fail
在我们举行听证会之后 After we had held our hearings
我们以为要六个月到九个月 we thought we would take six months to nine months
甚至一年 even a year
起草我们最初的规章制度 to draft our initial regulations
这太复杂了 我们真的想花点时间把事情做好 This was so complicated that we wanted to really take our time and get it right
发生的事是金额箱倒塌了 Uh What happened was though amount box collapsed
我觉得这给了我们一种全新的紧迫感 and I think that gave us a real renewed sense of urgency
我们意识到 如果监管得当 And we realized that if we got regulation right,
我们可以 we could
对比特币更有信心 create more confidence in bit coin
坦白说 frankly
不仅是丝绸之路的案子 uh not only from the silk road case
还有牛奶的崩塌 but also from the collapse of milk
所以你的感觉 So your sense
虽然 though
现在的监管者 我想你已经和我们讨论过的讨论过了 of the regulators right now, I assume you've had conversations with the discussions that we've had
我想每个人都认识到了创新 不想扼杀它 Um I think everybody recognizes the innovation and doesn't want to stifle it
他们只是想确保有健康的规章制度 They just wanna make sure that there's healthy regulations
以及富有成效的方式 and productive manner.
我不会放弃纽约 纽约要放弃我了 I'm not giving up on new york. New york's giving up on me.
我是来开玩笑的 投币机 I came to turn on a bit. Coin machine,
自动取款机 我不能打开它 an ATM. I can't turn it on.
我不能做交易 我什么都做不了 I can't make trades. I can't do anything.
没有现金流 There's no cash flow
完全 at all.
以及潜在的监管 是啊 And its potential regulation. It's uh
规则 我应该相信 是从管道里下来的 regulation, I should believe, uh is coming down the uh pipe.
我不想做别人不喜欢的事 I don't wanna do anything that someone's frowning upon
就在股市隔壁 right next door to stock market
他们会把我关起来的 They're gonna lock me up
你知道你不能交换 You Know You can't have an exchange
我们不见面 然后互相交流纽约坐在那里高高在上全世界都在等待 we don't people meet then exchange with each other new york sitting there on the high horse and the whole world's waiting
在纽约创造一些该死的执照 on new york to create some fucking license.
最终丢失密钥办公室提出了比特许可证的最终规则 Ultimately loss keys office brought out the final rules for the bit license
2015年春天 In the spring of 2015
很多公司抱怨说法规太繁重 他们无法在纽约经营 也无法赚钱 a lot of companies complained that the regulations were too burdensome for them to operate new york and still make money
我一夜之间看到了几十家即将上市的公司 I saw just overnight dozens of companies that were on the verge of launching
能负担得起他的新公司的空气费 can afford this air for his new company
如果Shape shift想让客户留在纽约 就必须申请bit许可证 Shape shift would have had to apply for the bit license if it wanted to keep customers in new york
所以在我的大腿上 我有 So In my lap here, I have the
《虚拟货币经营许可申请表》 the application forms for license to engage in virtual currency business activity,
这是一种非常有地位的说法 这是 which is a very status way of of saying the the bit license. This is
这是要批准的申请 this is the application to be approved to
基本上做什么 do basically what
我们都这么多年了 we've all been doing for years now
在纽约的公司之间建立 which is building between companies in new york
里面有很多东西 And a lot of stuff in here
我个人觉得是不道德的 I personally feel is unethical
所以我们不会遵守的 So we're not gonna comply with it
这意味着我们必须完全封锁纽约人 which means we have to block new yorkers entirely
当一个全新的产业开始封锁像纽约这样曾经是世界金融中心的地方时 And When an entire new industry starts blocking a place like new york that used to be the financial center of the world
希望有些政客会注意到这一点 hopefully some of those politicians will take notice the point of it is to one
确保有足够的消费者保护措施确保我们有足够的网络安全 Make sure there are enough consumer protections to make sure we have adequate cyber security
三个 Three
确保公司的资本充足 这样他们就不会自食其果 make sure that the companies are adequately capitalized, so they don't collapse upon themselves
你知道你看到了强硬派和那些说你知道你必须有足够的创新空间的人之间的拔河比赛 You Know You've seen a tug of war between the hardliners and and those who are saying you know you've got to have enough space for innovation in here
系统已经出来了 And the system has has come out
我想这可能会让你更坚强 I think probably stronger as a result of that
在商业比特币社区中有广泛的观点 Uh And there's a widespread view amongst certainly the business bit coin community
某种程度的监管使他们的行为合法化 that some level of regulation gives legitimacy to what they're doing
它让人们对自己的所作所为充满信心 It gives people confidence in what they're doing
这是成长过程中很重要的一部分 This is an important part of growing up
最终 他们不会做对的 因为不 Ultimately, they're not gonna get it right, because no
监管从来都是有效的 但我很有信心 regulation has ever writes. But uh I'm highly confident that whatever
往前走 嗯 um happens going forward, um
比特币许可证将被视为比特币进化过程中的一个积极发展 the bit license will be looked at as a as a positive development in the in the evolution of of bit coin
因为它消除了最大的不确定性之一 because it just removed one of the biggest pieces of uncertainty
这个行业该如何监管 Which is how is this industry gonna be regulated
我想我们大多数人 至少很多人 I think most of us, at least a lot of us um
你认为合理的监管规定了确保 think that sensible regulation that sets guidelines that make sure
人们的钱不仅仅是进了黑洞 people's money doesn't just go into a black hole
那个规定 thing uh that regulation,
我确定 I'm sure
所以她不愿意看到这种事情 这不是基于程序员习惯的逻辑和原因 So she wouldn't be happy to see this kind of thing, which is not based on the the logic and reason that a programmer is used to
我认为很多开发人员都可以理解 所以尽量避免使用 I think a lot of developers understandably, so try to stay out of the
政治废话 political nonsense.
这是网上流传的最大谜团之一 It has been one of the biggest mysteries raging across the internet
谁是satoshi nakamoto Who is satoshi nakamoto
《新闻周刊》发表了一篇文章声称这些图片中的人是比特币的创始人 Newsweek published an article claiming the man in these images is the bit coin founder
创造比特币的人被称为比特币之父 The man who created bit coin is known as the father of bit coin
网络货币 the online currency
现在价值数十亿 Now worth billions
当你问他比特币的事他说 When you asked him about bit coin and he says
我不能再谈这个了 I can't talk about this anymore
但和我在一起 but with me
他肯定承认那枚硬币 He definitely acknowledge that coin
我想现在他是说他被谈话搞糊涂了 I think at this point now he's saying he was confused by the conversation
很明显有人认为我们这么做是为了对抗海洋是科莫多或是大女王 Clearly somebody thought that we did this as an act of war against that ocean are komodo or big queen
当然不是那个意思 certainly never meant it that way.
我和比特币没关系 I have nothing to do with bit coin.
那是个怪物的故事 It was a monster story
他们怎么知道的 How did they figure it out
天啊 看看他们给他起的名字 Oh My God Look at this guy that they named
他叫多里安·萨托什·中本 His His name is dorian satoshi nakamoto
住在加州 living in California
基本上都藏在明处 basically hiding in plain sight
变成了一场巨大的媒体争夺战 it becomes a gigantic media scramble
然后多里安从他家里出来 看起来有点邋遢 And then dorian emerges from his house looking kind of disheveled
他说他不完全是中本说他从没听说过比特币 and says he's not a totally nakamoto says he's never heard of bit coin
他不明白 He doesn't understand
他和莉亚谈过一次 He had one conversation with leah
她误解了他的话 She misunderstood what he said
她走错了路 She took it the wrong way
你可能要成为一个密码朋克才能理解其中所有的元素 and you probably would have had to have been a cipher punk to understand all the elements of it that had already been put together
在我看来 这种可能性很低 因为完全来自社区之外的某个人碰巧知道所有这些不同的事情 并把它们组合在一起 不知从哪里冒出来 The odds of it seems very low to me that it was somebody from completely outside that community who happened to know all these different things and put this together and appear out of nowhere
《新闻周刊》报道出来的那天 多里安·纳卡莫托被称为创作者 是个大人物 The day that news week's story came out naming dorian nakamoto as the creator a big one
我收到一封来自一位老熟人的邮件 标题是 I got this EMAIL from an old acquaintance that was titled
可能性有多大 事实上 What are the odds? And it's laid out the fact that
哈尔·芬尼住在离多里安·纳卡莫托已知地址不到两英里的地方 hal finney lives less than 2 miles away from the known address of dorian nakamoto
《新闻周刊》找到他的地方 where newsweek had found him
这个数字对于用户来说是多么有趣啊 And How funny is the number to ever user a big point
谁收到了第一笔比特币交易 Who received the first bit coin transaction
他研究了一个匿名货币系统的早期原型 He works on an early prototype of an anonymous currency system
他是个密码朋克 He was a cipher punk
怎么会是大硬币的创造者和这个未经证实的第二个大硬币使用者从未合作过这种健康呢 So how could it be that the purported creator of big coin and this non confirmed second ever user a big one had never collaborated that health
芬尼 Finney
他在中本岛的时候离这里不到2英里 没有帮助制造比特币或者他真的是个大弹坑 who was less than 2 miles away from during nakamoto, hadn't helped to create bit coin or maybe he really was the crater a big one
也许哈尔·芬尼在海上是科莫多 Maybe hal finney was at ocean are komodo
当你看比特币白皮书时 When you look at the bit coin white paper
投入比特币的项目 projects that fed into bit coin
但值得注意的是 其中没有提到的一个项目是尼克的老板有点冷淡 But it's very notable that the one project it doesn't refer to is nick's a boss bit cold
这也许是最接近比特币的先例 也是最接近比特币的 which is perhaps the closest precedent and the closest parallel to bit coin
让我泡菜就差一点了 Let me pickled is so close to bit coin
你知道尼克可能是satoshi that you know maybe nick is satoshi.
很多人会说 A lot of people will say
中本一定是萨博 nakamoto must be sabo
中本一定是芬妮 Nakamoto must have been finny
但我觉得他不想留下面包屑让别人跟着走 But I I don't think he was trying to leave any bread crumbs out there for anybody to follow
我跟编辑说过了 I told my editor about it
他同意你找到了 He agreed that you found
所以她中本 so she nakamoto
所以我坐上了去圣巴巴拉的飞机 开车去他家里疗养 So I got on a plane to santa barbara and I drove out to health in his house
完全瘫痪 completely paralyzed by a ls
这是一种非常可怕的衰弱的绝症 它会慢慢地关闭你的身体 同时让你的思想完好无损 this really awful debilitating terminal illness that slowly shuts down your body while leaving your minds completely intact
他身体能力开始衰退的时间和那个时候基本吻合 And the time when he started to fade in his physical abilities did roughly coincide with the time
那是一个敏感的中本开始消失了 That's a touchy nakamoto started to disappear
也许这就是中本选择消失的原因 That maybe the reason that's a touching nakamoto had chosen to fade away
噪音 noise.
有很多关于a型度量的研究 There have been a number of style a metric studies
你可以看到她写的索托和尼克写的有很多相似之处 And you see so many of these similarities between soto she's writing and those of nick's
包括这些小东西 including these little things
还有其他人不会用的短语和拼写 and phrases and spellings that nobody else uses.
所以我尽可能多地跟地狱说话 主要是 So I talked to hell as much as I could, mostly in a kind of
单向采访 因为他只能做出回应 one way interview, because he could really only respond
回答是或否 with yes or no answers.
他否认自己是satoshi nakamoto And he denied being satoshi nakamoto
你可以看出他被我以为他在海上的想法逗乐了 You could tell that he was amused by the whole idea that I thought he was at ocean
不是模特 not the model
纽约最了不起的事情之一 One of the really remarkable things from nyx
是 is
那个尼克 that nick
在回应一些关于他发表的一篇关于大黄金的评论时 他问了其他正在读他的人 in responding to some comments about a post he had made about big gold, actually asked the other people who are reading him
如果有人想帮他把这个想法编码成真正的软件 If anybody wanted to help him code this idea into real software
可以用的 that could work
它从未变成现实 It was never turned into a reality
但当你看到大金的时候 But when you look at big gold
很难不被它和大硬币之间的其他相似之处所打动 it's it's hard not to be struck by other similarities between it and and big coin
是一对 是齐波和健康的膝盖 现在呢 it was a duo, it was zi bo and healthy knee. And now
有可能 it's possible.
怎么可能是尾声 我不知道 And how could have been the coda? Um I don't know
你知道健康和健康可能是比特币的鬼魂密码 You Know This idea that the health and it could have been the kind of ghost coda for bit coin,
嗯 Um,
我想这是可能的 I guess it's possible
其他人对阅读或互联网的其他部分有所猜测 other people kind of speculating on read it or other parts of the internet
我想也许是因为健康 他用了多利安·中本作为替罪羊如果他被追查到的话 thought that maybe health and he had used dorian nakamoto as a patsy if he were ever traced back to
dorian nakamoto似乎是这个人的创造者而健康的膝盖会被免疫 dorian nakamoto would seem like this guy was the creator and healthy knee would be sort of immunized from it
已经发布了他们和索托的通讯 这个时期的她 has released their communications with soto. She from this period,
尼克一直避免这样做 在《大人物》发行后的关键几个月里基本上保持沉默 nick has avoided doing that and essentially went silent in those critical months after big one was released,
你知道的 you know,
当你和别人面对面交谈 他们告诉你这些事情时 when you talk to people face to face and they tell you these things,
你可以感受到他们的诚实 还有 you can get a sense of their being honest. And
如果健康和他真的有秘密的话 if health and he actually had a secret
十亿美元现金 一大笔硬币 billion dollar cash, a big coins,
他不会对我撒谎的 he wouldn't have been able to lie to me so effectively about it
最后 In the end
相信这一切只是巧合的理由开始超过巧合本身 The reasons to believe that this was all just a coincidence began to outweigh the coincidence itself
就像鳗鱼一样 It's almost like an eel
那里有些东西 There is something there
你看得出来 You can see it
但只要你一碰 but as soon as you touch
它从你手中滑落 你一无所有 it it just slides right out of your hands and you're left with nothing
任何在塞弗朋克运动中有名气的人 Anybody who is of any note in the cypher punk movement
即使是在外面也曾有过一段时间被称为satoshi And even outside of it too has at one time or another been called satoshi
芬尼是怎么否认的 How finney denied it
一个例子否定了这一点 An example denied it
他们都否认了 They've all denied it
可能其中一个是satoshi May be one of them is satoshi
也许他们都是 Maybe all of them are sort
她真是个谜 Oh She really is a mystery
是 啊 Yeah,
噪音 noise
是 啊 yeah
噪音 noise
噪音 noise noise
噪音 noise
噪音 noise.
那是你原来的票子 That's your original ticker
隔壁来的 from next door.
好吧 所以我们在这里 All right. So we're over here,
比特币 离这里的证券交易所700英尺 bit coin, 700 feet from the stock exchange over here.
还有 And
你们中的一些人上周 前几周都受到了打击 you know some of you guys took a hit last week, last couple weeks,
很多大块头都到了 a lot of the big guys, they got there
立足于 foothold in the business that
一开始他们不参与 they weren't a part of in the beginning.
我不知道怎么回事 I don't know what's going on,
但我不知道 but I don't know.
我不会那么容易就把比特币注销的 I wouldn't write off bit coin that easy.
我知道大硬币会变的 I know that big coin is going to change
世界已经在改变世界了 The world is changing the world already
我们必须挺身而出 and we have to stand tall
骄傲 and proud.
休斯敦大学 Uh
作为大角落和早期的医生 as big corners and earlier doctors
他们对新技术一无所知 they don't know anything about new technology
但一旦开始有意义了 But once it starts making sense,
他们把钱扔在后面 they throw the dollars behind it.
你知道不幸的是 You Know Unfortunately,
早期的医生 earlier doctors
制作 make
我们走过的路 the roads that we all travel down
通常是在这个过程中铺好的 and they are usually paved over in the process
第一个穿过门的人中枪了 The first guy through the door gets shot,
但总得有人进门吧 you know but somebody's got to go through the door
但他们会中枪的 but they're gonna get shot
什么 What
查理·施拉姆 Charlie schram
罗斯·乌布里希特 朱利安 香肠 Ross ulbricht, julian, a sausage
他们从门进来时中枪了 They got shot coming through the door
利用提供给我们的自由和技术因为他们会敲门 utilizing the freedoms and technologies afforded to us because they knock the door down
嘿 迈克尔 Hey, Michael,
我能给你打个免提电话吗 can I put you on speaker phone for a minute?
如果我知道怎么做的话 If I know how
嘿 Hey
迈克尔 我能问你吗 Michael, can I ask you
你在哪里买的比特币 Where Did Where did you buy bit coins
我做了什么是的 What did I yeah,
交换的次数 um the number of exchanges that
你输了吗 你还有多少钱 did you lose? How much do you still have them
放进去 你能用吗 put into it? Can you use it?
我想买吗 不 今天不行 它会出现的 Do I want to buy it? No, not today, though. It is going to be around,
我不知道 I don't know.
你用它买过东西吗 Did you ever use it to buy anything?
休斯敦大学 Uh
我赢了 我的金子 um I got a win. My gold
没有 not.
不 好的 我们应该回去告诉你 no. Okay We should go back to you know
第一天 从头开始 day one and just start all over
别管比特币了 Forget about bit coin
换个说法吧 Call it something else
我想丝绸之路的事已经让它失去了光彩 I think it's been so tarnished now with this uh with the silk road
嗯 um,
你知道我只是觉得 you know I just think
你知道所有的东西都消失了大约4亿美元 you know that all that stuff about $400 million disappearing and
你只是不能离开地面 没人会 uh you're just not going to get off the ground. Nobody's gonna
你知道喜欢喝酒 巴菲特说 离它远点 you know like wine. Buffet said. Stay the hell away from it.
还有 And Uh
是 啊 yeah,
把所有的牌放在桌子上 to put all the cards on the table
我将在未来几周内离开部门 I'm gonna be leaving the department in the coming weeks
我在任期内想我们要做的事 uh what I thought we'd be working on during my tenure
数字货币不可能排在榜首 digital currencies would not have been at the Top of the list
是 啊 Yeah,
是 啊 yeah
是 啊 yeah.
所以ben los ke创造了一个叫做服从许可证的东西 So ben los ke created this thing called obey license
这个可怕的新技术 现在是法律了 uh this scary new technology. It's now law.
他已经宣布要离开政府去建立自己的政府 And he has announced that he is leaving uh government in order to set up his own
帮助公司的私人咨询公司 private consulting firm to help companies
导航 navigate
金融法规 比如他创建的比特许可证 financial regulations such as the bit license that he created.
所以我们基本上建立了一个美丽的新生态系统 So we essentially had this beautiful new ecosystem being built.
本输了 他过来了 And ben lost. He comes by
说 says
我是来保护消费者的 I'm here to protect consumers
他在周围筑起了一堵巨大的墙 He builds a huge wall around the thing
然后他坐在大门外面 命令人们进去 And then he sits outside the gate charging people to get in
这就是裙带资本主义的定义 还有 This is the very definition of crony capitalism. And
出于某种原因 贝纳西甚至没看出有什么不对劲 for some reason, benassi doesn't even see anything wrong with that.
我认为历史不会像他想的那样对他有好的评价 I I think history will not judge him as favorably as he thinks.
所以乔布斯开始了我自己的咨询业务 So Um Yeah Um Jobs started up my own uh consulting business.
在金融科技领域做了很多工作很有意思 Uh It's been quite interesting doing a lot of work uh in the fin tech space
金融服务业的公司也是 uh companies in the financial services world as well.
本在d f s的丢失钥匙小组正在调查 Ben loss keys team at the d f s that was working on
这张比特币计划的比特币许可证最终都离开了这个机构 去了一些咨询公司 他们正在研究这些问题 this this this bit license on the bit coin initiative have all ended up leaving the agency and going to consulting firms that are now working on these issues
丹尼·圣坛会帮上忙的 Danny altar is going to work for it bit
想办法和d f s合作 拿到他们自己开店的许可证 to find a way to partner with the d f s to get license to open their own bit
硬币兑换处 Coin exchange
是 啊 Yeah,
噪音 noise.
等一切结束 我一定会尽可能离开纽约的 When this is over. Definitely gonna leave new york when I can
我要去哪 Um Where I'm gonna go
我不知道 I don't know
不 它不能促进创新 there's no it doesn't foster innovation
有大公司太难了 It's too difficult to have a big company
没有银行会开户 No banks will open up accounts
你是监管的威胁 You're the threat of regulation
高调逮捕 high profile arrest
像我和其他人一样 like myself and others
没人想处理这事 It's no one wants to deal with it
两年半前我接管摩根大通的外汇支付业务时 你什么时候开始接受这笔钱的 When did you first start taking it on the coin to two and half years ago when I took over the foreign exchange payments business at j p morgan
所以你可能得在那一刻给盒子加上量 So you probably had to amount box that instant
我一直都很有意思 周围的人几乎都没有了 i've been as interesting almost none of those guys around anymore
两年前 Two years ago
所有大银行的比特币都是一种事后诸葛亮的想法可能是在饮水机旁的走廊里 all the major banks bit coin was an after thought it was kind of a you know maybe in a hallway conversation at at the at the water cooler
现在你知道 就在这周 我会见了一家大银行中的一家 And now you know even this week I met with 1 of 1 of the major banks
每个人都有一个硬币专家 Everyone's got a bit coin specialist
如何将这项技术融入他们现有的运作中 how to incorporate the technology into their existing operation
与金融系统有关的银行和机构 banks and institutions associated with the financial system
区块链技术 the block chain technology
比特币已经成为很多人现在非常喜欢的东西 underlying bit coin has become something that a lot of people are now very
不管是允许衍生产品转让还是证券转让 还是 whether it's allowing for derivatives to be transferred or securities to be transferred, or
以复杂有趣的方式转让各种金融工具 all manner of financial instruments to be transferred in complex interesting ways
我认为不同的公司会采取不同的策略 I think different companies are going to adopt different strategies
看像数字资产控股这样的公司会很有意思的 And it's gonna be fascinating to watch companies like digital asset holdings
非常有趣的工作 uh very very interesting work.
是 啊 Yeah,
直到2014年末 我才意识到比特币有任何意义 I didn't become aware of bit coin in any meaningful sense until uh 2014 late in the year
怀疑论 of skepticism
但它没有底层技术所能达到的全部能力 Uh But it doesn't have uh the full extent of the power that the underlying technology has to achieve
妻子主人不只是银行家 Wife masters is not just any banker
我认为这个人是过去三十年来金融业最有问题的创新的幕后黑手 this person who I think is really seen as being behind some of the most problematic innovations in the financial industry over the last three decades
为什么本质上是因为信用违约掉期而获得信贷的人 Why is the one who is essentially given credit for creating the credit default swap,
这基本上提供了一种押注债券违约的方法 which essentially provides a way to bet on the default of a bond
而信用违约掉期最终成为了金融危机的中心 And the credit default swap ended up taking this place at the center of the financial crisis
银行对次级抵押贷款的押注 And these bets that banks had made against sub prime mortgages
休斯敦大学 uh
区块链技术消除了系统中大量的低效率 block chain technology eradicate a significant amount of inefficiency in the system
降低成本 and reduces costs
这并不意味着我们完全不需要信任金融服务业 It doesn't mean that we are doing away with the need for trust in financial services at all
比特币的目的是想办法绕过华尔街 Bit coin was designed to find a way to circumvent wall street
盲人大师们所做的基本上就是想办法把华尔街变成比特币 让他们也能使用这项技术 And what blind masters is doing is essentially trying to find ways to bring wall street into bit coin and make it possible for them to use this technology as well
创建他们自己的私有区块链 让他们的电脑为其供电而不是这些匿名矿工 is create their own private block chain where their computers are powering it rather than these anonymous miners
他们想要控制系统 They want control over the system
银行正在研究各种各样的方法来利用它 The banks are looking at this incredibly wide array of ways that they might use this,
包括取代证券交易所 which include you know replacing stock exchanges
正在寻找新的方式在国家间转移资金 are finding new ways to move money between countries
比特币的概念 idea of bit coin
但现在它发生在这些金融机构内部而不是比特币所想象的外部 But now it's happening within these financial institutions rather than outside it as bit coin had imagine
我对金融业的银行系统没有意见主要是因为 I have no problem with the the banking system in the financial industry co opting big coin primarily because
比特币不能真的被增选 bit coin can't really be co opted
他们是谁 有多少钱 who they are, how much money they have.
我觉得这对比特币有好处 I think it's all good for bit coin
我认为华尔街和硅谷正在发生的所有创新 I think all of the innovation that's happening both on wall street and in silicon valley
或者谁想让你知道试着对区块链上发生的任何产品或服务收取比他们应该多的费用 uh or who want to you know try to charge more than they should for whatever product or service that is happening on the block chain
真的跟广告上说的一样 It really is as advertised
所有使用它的人 by all the people who are using it
它的设计是为了 And it really is designed just to be a a a more efficient
更公平的互联网价值传递方式 more fair way of sending value of the internet
比特币不是中性的 Bit coin is not neutral
你不能排除政治因素 You cannot remove the political component
她在比特币中间植入了一个脚趾这是华尔街很多人都想做的事 That's a toe she implanted in between from bit coin is what a lot of the people on the wall street's i'd try to do
你不能中和比特币 You cannot neutralize bit coin
有能力 able,
谢天谢地 thankfully
你知道像样的食物和上百个这样的人 you know decent food and kind of a hundred hundred people that are
白领 那些在监狱里的人是最能利用大局的人 white collar. Those guys in prison are the best ones to use a big point
他们很聪明 我很高兴能和他们谈谈 that they're smart. I'm very excited to talk to them about it.
这个 The
是 啊 yeah
和 and
是的 现在是录像机在开这玩意 他们把钱都投进去了 so yes the vcr driving this thing right now they're pouring money into it
他们在建这些盈利公司 They're They're building these for profit companies
有比特币以外背景的人看到了比特币的价值 People who have a background outside of bit coin seen the value of incoming to it
但是 But
他们所做的一切并不意味着乌托邦的自由主义者必须离开 just because they're doing everything they're doing doesn't mean that the libertarians in the utopians have to go away
硬币是开源的 The coin is open source
你想用它做什么都行 You can do whatever you want with it
所以他们还在那里他们还在生产他们的产品 So they're still there they're still building their products
他们还在构建他们的愿景 They're still building their vision
如果女王成为主流 And if the queen goes mainstream
如果它被捡起来了 and if it gets picked up
他们会成为其中的一部分 they're going to be elements of that
乌托邦运动就是这样的 And that's that's kind of what utopia movements always are
乌托邦人梦寐以求的事情不会像他们预期的那样发生 The thing that utopians were dreaming about is not gonna happen the way they expected it
但我认为它会过滤掉你会看到的 But I do think it is going to filter through and you are gonna see it.
你会看到的 You're gonna see.
所以你要让我看看这是个触动的马达 So you're gonna show me it's a touching motor
问题 issue.
对 Yes.
有些人会相信有些人不会 Some people will believe some people won't
告诉你真相 And to tell you the truth
但你可以对我说真心话 but you can say hand on heart to me.
我太感动火车头了 I am so touching locomotive.
我是其中的主角 I was the main part of it.
其他人帮我 我要走到镜头前 Other people help me. I'm going to come in front of the camera
一次 once.
我永远不会 and I will never
再也不上镜头了 ever be on a camera ever again
对于任何电视台 for any t v station
或者任何媒体 or any media?
是 啊 Yeah,
噪音 noise
是 啊 yeah
噪音 noise
噪音 noise.
休斯敦大学 uh
是 啊 yeah
这个 the
那个 the the the
以及 and the
那个 the the
男人和 man and
和 and
是 啊 yeah
然后 then
和 and
是 啊 yeah
还有 and.
休斯敦大学 uh
五 five
噪音 noise
是 啊 yeah
和 and
我很好 I'm fine
时间 time
和 and
休斯敦大学 uh
和 and
这个 the
嗯 um
和 and
还有 and.